There's a quote by Dan Carlin, to paraphrase, if I was a civilian in a disaster in a war, would I think that I was to blame for my country, or would I just feel that I was being grinded in the gears of history? My wife made me turn this off this morning, because she was starting to cry. I have sympathy for those in the gears on all sides.
Claiming it is a left/right thing instead of a power, money, and wealth thing is a mistake. I am a leftist and I am socialist (the horrors!), but I have never approved of the Israeli slow genocide of the Palestinians, nor have I have ever supported the PLO, and now Hamas, habit of murdering civilians. It does not matter the reason. The murder of children is evil.
How am I a victim blamer? I am only saying what I have been reading for over forty years. Did I say that the innocent dead, which was anyone not in uniform and certainly the children, deserved to be butchered?
Both sides commit atrocities and always use the past atrocities of the other side to justify their acts.
I do not know about rape, but murder and torture, yes, including of children in the West Bank. It happens in ones and twos with the justification of security. Stealing farms and homes on that some reason.
And if dropping bombs on neighborhoods in Gaza is not mass violence and murder, what is?
The thing is that the IDF wants to sanitize their violence and blame the victims for their suffering, while Hamas wants to openly show their violence, their murders and rapes.
Both are guilty of horrific crimes and if someone doesn’t see it, it is because they don’t want to. It is just like someone who will blame the innocent Israelis for their being raped and murdered because of what the IDF has done. The other side did bad things, which means my side can do no wrong. Even when it does.
Cunts like you is why I am no longer a registered Democrat, why don't support the Left, and why I will vote for anyone not named Trump with an R next to their name. GTFO out of US or whatever western country you reside in and move the fuck to Palestine you filth asscunt
Just how is it a leftist and conservative thing? Are we going by the propaganda that Jeremey Corbyn was an antisemite? Historically, antisemitism existed across class, political, and religious lines. Much like the bigotry against Blacks. Pointing out the evil actions of others does not make one a hater. And today, Hamas and the IDF have extremely bloody hands.
I don't know where *antisemitism* factors into this? It's just a simple fact that people on the left tend to support Palestine, and people on the right tend to support Israel.
In the past, the left, whatever that overly broad category is, has supported the Jews. Also, many have supported the Palestinians. Both of whom are separate from the governments that they are under. Please do not forget that the issue of modern *state* and government of Israel, which is separate category from the Jewish people, has its immediate roots in the 1800s. Different political factions and countries have supported different factions of Jews, Palestinians, and Israelis.
Perhaps the better question is, does one support ethnic cleansing by anyone especially by mass slaughter? You will find supporters and doers of such on both sides of this conflict going back for generations with them all using the evils from the other side's past to justify evil done today. Whatever my politics, I am against the slaughter of innocents whomever they are and against whoever does it.
There is a nontrivial portion of the right which supports Israel because of prophecy. I suspect that general attitude migrates. Those prophecies don’t count the cost of the dying, and are warlike anyway.
Of course, religious warfare really is part of what’s going on here, on all 3 sides, and savagery is intertwined with that always whether it’s overt or covert. I think it has to be acknowledged. Positive feedback cycle: abusive practices making lives miserable makes martyrdom seem useful gives a reason for more martial abuse etc etc.
That theory really holds up considering Palestinians were massacring the then Jewish minority a hundred years ago. Or that the "Nakba" is mainly a catastrophe in the eyes of Palestinians because they lost the civil war they started, and weren't able to massacre the Jews "from the river to the sea" in 1948.
Like 9/11, the Israeli deep state allowed this attack to happen. That’s the commonality between the American and Israeli deep states. They both follow a philosophy and methodology of pursuing a particular geopolitical agenda by attrition, specifically a numbers game of actively allowing the murder of a minority of its citizens in order to ultimately justify the even more substantial mass homicide of the other people seen as standing in the way of those geopolitical agendas. I mean, seriously, how absurd is the notion that the most militarized state in the world per capita could’ve been so ‘unprepared’ for this attack? It’s as absurd as the notion that not just one but two airliners could fly directly over the airspace of Manhattan, let alone one directly over DC as well, without one Air Force jet being scrambled to intercept when that nation has something called NORAD? We have been living in an age of false flags, and no governments understand that playbook better than the American and Israeli governments. For those thinking I’m just a tinfoil-hatted conspiracy theorist, I would point anyone to the following article ‘How Israel Helped to Spawn Hamas’ from the Wall Street Journal, not exactly a left wing antisemitic rag:
“Instead of trying to curb Gaza's Islamists from the outset, says Mr. Cohen, Israel for years tolerated and, in some cases, encouraged them as a counterweight to the secular nationalists of the Palestine Liberation Organization and its dominant faction, Yasser Arafat's Fatah. Israel cooperated with a crippled, half-blind cleric named Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, even as he was laying the foundations for what would become Hamas. Sheikh Yassin continues to inspire militants today”
Looks like this comment section is well on its way to being as big of a delusional mess as this essay is. Great opportunity for fine-grained learning of how neurotypicals think about matters far too complex for them to understand, invoking strong emotions, degrading their thinking quality further.
'' “Decolonization” is just left-speak for ethnically cleansing the right people — which, we now definitively know, includes the Jews. '' What a load of shit. This is 70+ years of ethnic tension and conflict. It is colonizer vs settler, the oppressor vs the oppressed, it is only a matter of circumstances that one side of that conflict, and in this case the side doing the oppressing, is Jewish.
Too often the proponents of things like decolonization do not truly think through their positions. While it is very true that Western countries and empires have invaded, oppressed, even slaughtered populations in other parts of the world for centuries, pointing that out to support the oppression, even slaughter, of people living today is worst than victim blaming. It the support for the very evils that the West has done. Nobody's hands are without blood and creating more blood, just creates more blood.
There is a difference between supporting bloodshed and being against the status quo. Hamas is not the answer, but neither is the Palestinians silently resigning to being treated as subhumans by Israel. Articles like this promote a narrow-minded and one-sided way of looking at the situation as “someone is trying to eradicate Jews again” and the “good vs evil” when the Palestine/Israel conflict absolutely must be analysed with nuance and with all the factors in mind.
“Creating more blood creates more blood” again, acts of brutality and terrorism are not the answer, but neither is standing idly, which is what the rest of the world has been doing for more than half a century while the Palestinians suffered
Who takes children hostage you Leftist ghoul? What 'progressive' cause is raping civilians, torturing them? You lunatics have zero moral ground to stand on.
Did you read anything that I wrote or do you just parrot the same point over and over? Are you people allergic to nuance and looking at a complex situation as something that’s not black and white? Nobody is excusing the crimes of Hamas or gloating that civilians are being slaughtered.
And what about the militarist theocratic state of Israel conducting a slow genocide of the Palestinian civilians during the past decades? How do you propose to solve that part of the ordeal? Or do you think that Hamas sprung out of nowhere?
There's a quote by Dan Carlin, to paraphrase, if I was a civilian in a disaster in a war, would I think that I was to blame for my country, or would I just feel that I was being grinded in the gears of history? My wife made me turn this off this morning, because she was starting to cry. I have sympathy for those in the gears on all sides.
Well said brother.
Bravo!!
Claiming it is a left/right thing instead of a power, money, and wealth thing is a mistake. I am a leftist and I am socialist (the horrors!), but I have never approved of the Israeli slow genocide of the Palestinians, nor have I have ever supported the PLO, and now Hamas, habit of murdering civilians. It does not matter the reason. The murder of children is evil.
Fuck you. There is no "slow genocide of the Palestinians." Victim blamer.
How am I a victim blamer? I am only saying what I have been reading for over forty years. Did I say that the innocent dead, which was anyone not in uniform and certainly the children, deserved to be butchered?
Both sides commit atrocities and always use the past atrocities of the other side to justify their acts.
Really? Both sides are equal here? Israeli soldiers purposely kill, rape, torture innocent people? You are actually saying that you low life freak?
I do not know about rape, but murder and torture, yes, including of children in the West Bank. It happens in ones and twos with the justification of security. Stealing farms and homes on that some reason.
And if dropping bombs on neighborhoods in Gaza is not mass violence and murder, what is?
The thing is that the IDF wants to sanitize their violence and blame the victims for their suffering, while Hamas wants to openly show their violence, their murders and rapes.
Both are guilty of horrific crimes and if someone doesn’t see it, it is because they don’t want to. It is just like someone who will blame the innocent Israelis for their being raped and murdered because of what the IDF has done. The other side did bad things, which means my side can do no wrong. Even when it does.
Cunts like you is why I am no longer a registered Democrat, why don't support the Left, and why I will vote for anyone not named Trump with an R next to their name. GTFO out of US or whatever western country you reside in and move the fuck to Palestine you filth asscunt
FU. you filth low life. You know nothing. You are just an ignorant antisemite.
Insulting me by implying I am a Democrat is a low blow. Actually, I am socialist, but whatever.
The murder of innocents is the murder of innocents regardless of which side does it. If that somehow makes me a "cunt" that is just fine with me.
Low life POS.
It is 100% a left/right thing; all that takes to see is having eyes. The left hates israel, the right supports israel.
Just how is it a leftist and conservative thing? Are we going by the propaganda that Jeremey Corbyn was an antisemite? Historically, antisemitism existed across class, political, and religious lines. Much like the bigotry against Blacks. Pointing out the evil actions of others does not make one a hater. And today, Hamas and the IDF have extremely bloody hands.
I don't know where *antisemitism* factors into this? It's just a simple fact that people on the left tend to support Palestine, and people on the right tend to support Israel.
In the past, the left, whatever that overly broad category is, has supported the Jews. Also, many have supported the Palestinians. Both of whom are separate from the governments that they are under. Please do not forget that the issue of modern *state* and government of Israel, which is separate category from the Jewish people, has its immediate roots in the 1800s. Different political factions and countries have supported different factions of Jews, Palestinians, and Israelis.
Perhaps the better question is, does one support ethnic cleansing by anyone especially by mass slaughter? You will find supporters and doers of such on both sides of this conflict going back for generations with them all using the evils from the other side's past to justify evil done today. Whatever my politics, I am against the slaughter of innocents whomever they are and against whoever does it.
There is a nontrivial portion of the right which supports Israel because of prophecy. I suspect that general attitude migrates. Those prophecies don’t count the cost of the dying, and are warlike anyway.
Of course, religious warfare really is part of what’s going on here, on all 3 sides, and savagery is intertwined with that always whether it’s overt or covert. I think it has to be acknowledged. Positive feedback cycle: abusive practices making lives miserable makes martyrdom seem useful gives a reason for more martial abuse etc etc.
That theory really holds up considering Palestinians were massacring the then Jewish minority a hundred years ago. Or that the "Nakba" is mainly a catastrophe in the eyes of Palestinians because they lost the civil war they started, and weren't able to massacre the Jews "from the river to the sea" in 1948.
Like 9/11, the Israeli deep state allowed this attack to happen. That’s the commonality between the American and Israeli deep states. They both follow a philosophy and methodology of pursuing a particular geopolitical agenda by attrition, specifically a numbers game of actively allowing the murder of a minority of its citizens in order to ultimately justify the even more substantial mass homicide of the other people seen as standing in the way of those geopolitical agendas. I mean, seriously, how absurd is the notion that the most militarized state in the world per capita could’ve been so ‘unprepared’ for this attack? It’s as absurd as the notion that not just one but two airliners could fly directly over the airspace of Manhattan, let alone one directly over DC as well, without one Air Force jet being scrambled to intercept when that nation has something called NORAD? We have been living in an age of false flags, and no governments understand that playbook better than the American and Israeli governments. For those thinking I’m just a tinfoil-hatted conspiracy theorist, I would point anyone to the following article ‘How Israel Helped to Spawn Hamas’ from the Wall Street Journal, not exactly a left wing antisemitic rag:
https://web.archive.org/web/20090926212507/http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123275572295011847.html
To quote from the article:
“Instead of trying to curb Gaza's Islamists from the outset, says Mr. Cohen, Israel for years tolerated and, in some cases, encouraged them as a counterweight to the secular nationalists of the Palestine Liberation Organization and its dominant faction, Yasser Arafat's Fatah. Israel cooperated with a crippled, half-blind cleric named Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, even as he was laying the foundations for what would become Hamas. Sheikh Yassin continues to inspire militants today”
The only thing worse than the killing of civilians is letting it continue.
Looks like this comment section is well on its way to being as big of a delusional mess as this essay is. Great opportunity for fine-grained learning of how neurotypicals think about matters far too complex for them to understand, invoking strong emotions, degrading their thinking quality further.
'' “Decolonization” is just left-speak for ethnically cleansing the right people — which, we now definitively know, includes the Jews. '' What a load of shit. This is 70+ years of ethnic tension and conflict. It is colonizer vs settler, the oppressor vs the oppressed, it is only a matter of circumstances that one side of that conflict, and in this case the side doing the oppressing, is Jewish.
Too often the proponents of things like decolonization do not truly think through their positions. While it is very true that Western countries and empires have invaded, oppressed, even slaughtered populations in other parts of the world for centuries, pointing that out to support the oppression, even slaughter, of people living today is worst than victim blaming. It the support for the very evils that the West has done. Nobody's hands are without blood and creating more blood, just creates more blood.
There is a difference between supporting bloodshed and being against the status quo. Hamas is not the answer, but neither is the Palestinians silently resigning to being treated as subhumans by Israel. Articles like this promote a narrow-minded and one-sided way of looking at the situation as “someone is trying to eradicate Jews again” and the “good vs evil” when the Palestine/Israel conflict absolutely must be analysed with nuance and with all the factors in mind.
“Creating more blood creates more blood” again, acts of brutality and terrorism are not the answer, but neither is standing idly, which is what the rest of the world has been doing for more than half a century while the Palestinians suffered
Who takes children hostage you Leftist ghoul? What 'progressive' cause is raping civilians, torturing them? You lunatics have zero moral ground to stand on.
Did you read anything that I wrote or do you just parrot the same point over and over? Are you people allergic to nuance and looking at a complex situation as something that’s not black and white? Nobody is excusing the crimes of Hamas or gloating that civilians are being slaughtered.
There's no nuance - Hamas cannot remain with its current terrorist capabilities.
And what about the militarist theocratic state of Israel conducting a slow genocide of the Palestinian civilians during the past decades? How do you propose to solve that part of the ordeal? Or do you think that Hamas sprung out of nowhere?